WP:CFD/T

See Wikipedia:Categories for deletion policies for the official rules of this page, and how to do cleanup.

Deletion of a category may mean that the articles and images in it are directly put in its parent category, or that another subdivision of the parent category is made. If they are already members of more suitable categories, it may also mean that they become a member of one category less.

How to use this page

Know if the category you are looking at needs deleting (or to be created). If it is a "red link" and has no articles or subcategories, then it is already deleted (more likely, it was never really created in the first place), and does not need to be listed here.
Read and understand Wikipedia:Categorization before using this page. Nominate categories that violate policies here, or are misspelled, mis-capitalized, redundant/need to be merged, not NPOV, small without potential for growth, or are generally bad ideas. (See also Wikipedia:Naming conventions and Wikipedia:Manual of Style.)
Please read the Wikipedia:Categorization of people policy if nominating or voting on a people-related category.
Unless the category to be deleted is non-controversial – vandalism or a duplicate, for example – please do not depopulate the category (remove the tags from articles) before the community has made a decision.
Add {{cfd}} to the category page for deletion. (If you are recommending that the category be renamed, you may also add a note giving the suggested new name.) This will add a message to it, and also put the page you are nominating into Category:Categories for deletion. It's important to do this to help alert people who are watching or browsing the category.
1. Alternately, use the rename template like this: {{cfr|newname}}
2. If you are concerned with a stub category, make sure to inform the WikiProject Stub sorting
Add new deletion candidates under the appropriate day near the top of this page.
1. Alternatively, if the category is a candidate for speedy renaming (see Wikipedia:Category renaming), add it to the speedy category at the bottom.
Make sure you add a colon (:) in the link to the category being listed, like [[:Category:Foo]]. This makes the category link a hard link which can be seen on the page (and avoids putting this page into the category you are nominating).
Sign any listing or vote you make by typing ~~~~ after your text.
Link both categories to delete and categories to merge into. Failure to do this will delay consideration of your suggestion.

Special notes

Some categories may be listed in Category:Categories for deletion but accidently not listed here.

Discussion for Today

This page is transcluded from Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024_December_1

December 1

NEW NOMINATIONS

Category:People sentenced to death

Propose deleting Category:People sentenced to death (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Fictional people sentenced to death (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: This would appear to fail WP:NONDEF, as being sentenced to death is potentially temporary and can be rescinded or rendered moot. It is not a "defining trait" like having been executed is. This deletion would also include all subcategories of "People sentenced to death" besides Category:Executed people, Category:Fictional executed characters and Category:Execution survivors. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 19:35, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:People sentenced to death seems a proper parent of the executed, survivors, paroled and sentenced in absentia subcategories. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:33, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There are books about their authors' stay in the death row, so being just sentenced (whether one is executed or not) might be relevant. Apokrif (talk) 22:13, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'd prefer this to be containerized rather than deleted, per Marco. ^SMason_Garrison 23:32, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep It seems quite defining as a sentence. One reason it is rendered moot is people dying from other causes while waiting for execution. Dimadick (talk) 05:32, 16 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

In that case they are perfectly fine in the prisoners category. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:55, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I notice only now that the fictional subcat contains a lot of articles directly in it, and there were a lot of articles and redirects in it that actually belonged in Category:Fictional executed characters. Then it makes more sense to turn this in a disambiguation page, directing to both Category:Fictional executed characters and Category:Fictional prisoners and detainees for characters that have and haven't been executed. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:23, 16 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Containerize?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 03:37, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: See above relisting comment.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:59, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Fictional bandits

Propose merging Category:Fictional bandits to Category:Fictional outlaws

Nominator's rationale: This category didn't exist until recently, it's rather duplicative with the merge target and can easily be construed as the exact same thing. Per WP:OVERLAPCAT, they should be merged back. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 19:24, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Merge or reverse merge, these are very closely related concepts. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:39, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Banditry involves acts of extortion, robbery, and murder, typically by members of organized gangs. Outlaws are persons declared as having no legal rights, giving practically everyone the right to kill them on sight. What they have done to deserve the loss of rights is less important than their legal status. Dimadick (talk) 05:45, 16 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Outlaw, being out of law, is an old Roman and Germanic concept, which does not apply to modern people and fictional characters. The word outlaw has evolved to similar to bandit. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:38, 16 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, The Bushranger _{One ping only} 06:15, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: I will tag Category:Fictional outlaws.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:33, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Mythological Greek epic poets

Propose merging Category:Mythological Greek epic poets to Category:Fictional poets

Nominator's rationale: merge, only two articles in the category, this is not helpful for navigation. Skipping parent Category:Fictional oral poets as a merge target because this has been nominated too. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:14, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Mythology is not the same as fiction, and these already seem to be in other subcategories of Category:Characters in Greek mythology by occupation anyway. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 15:46, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That is a fair point. Deletion is better indeed. The articles are already in Category:Musicians in Greek mythology. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:53, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Mythology should not be confused with fiction as there is not the same intent regarding truthful cosmological beliefs versus fiction made for entertainment. Jontesta (talk) 16:07, 27 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Rename to "Category:Mythological Greek poets", and include other notable figures who would fit such a grouping, such as Orpheus and Musaeus of Athens. Being a poet is undoubtedly defining for each of these figures (more defining than being a mythological musician, except perhaps for Orpheus). Having a category covering legendary poets in Greek mythology seems entirely sensible. – Michael Aurel (talk) 08:10, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If more articles can be added after renaming then let's do that. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:21, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Should this category be renamed/repurposed? If so, can we add enough articles to it?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:29, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:California pioneers

Propose merging Category:California pioneers to Category:19th-century people from California

Nominator's rationale: selectively merge, the real pioneers are already in Category:People of the Californias and Category:People of Alta California and it is an arbitrary choice to expand the pioneer period to the 1870s. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:06, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

But there are a lot of American pioneer categories. What about converting this into a container category to facilitate navigation? ^SMason_Garrison 23:33, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There are also numerous states that do not have a pioneers category and frankly I think that is for the better because it is pretty arbitrary to define a cut-off year. We may well turn Category:California pioneers into a disambiguation page though. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:53, 16 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, The Bushranger _{One ping only} 06:16, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Marcocapelle's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:22, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Smasongarrison: Thoughts? House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:22, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I still think containerizing Category:California pioneers is a better solution than deleting/merging. I think that there are cases were people are defined as being California pioneers. ^SMason_Garrison 21:52, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Fictional contortionists

Propose merging Category:Fictional contortionists to Category:Fictional circus performers

Nominator's rationale: Too small a category to be merited, with only a couple characters as members. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 14:28, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure if any of the articles should be in Category:Fictional circus performers. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:06, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Marcocapelle's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:20, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Private hospitals in Greece

Propose merging Category:Private hospitals in Greece to Category:Hospitals in Greece

Nominator's rationale: Only 1 entry. LibStar (talk) 02:39, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It should also be merged to Category:Private hospitals. But better expand this nomination with the Saudi Arabia and Vietnam siblings. Currently there aren't any individual private hospitals directly in Category:Private hospitals and it would not make much sense to have the Greek private hospital as the only biography there. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:43, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Actually found another Greek hospital and have added it. LibStar (talk) 06:12, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Strongly oppose, under-population is not a valid reason for deletion. It should be tagged appropriately under [[Category:Underpopulated categories]]. (Same response I had given to Haitian company founders below). LibStar, perhaps you can find other entries instead of creating these nominations considering you found second entry here? Savvyjack23 (talk) 16:46, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Savvyjack23: if you know any articles that belong in the category just add them instantly. That is more effective than tagging. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:02, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Savvyjack23, Perhaps you can find them to support your strongly oppose position. LibStar (talk) 23:22, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Can it be populated?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:14, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Merge. Two pages is not sufficient to justify keeping a category. ^SMason_Garrison 21:53, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Alumni of Coleg Cambria

Propose deleting Category:Alumni of Coleg Cambria (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: Category containing no articles. Category:Alumni of Yale College, Wrexham has been made a sub-category despite the fact that Yale College Wrexham is now defunct and the two alumni in the category graduated from it when it was not part of Coleg Cambria. This extra layer of categorisation is inaccurate and makes absolutely no sense. AusLondonder (talk) 19:44, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment There is now an article and a category (the one that you removed, AusLondonder) in this nominated category, so it is no longer an empty category. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 06:44, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yep that's why I took it to CSD instead of speedy. The article wasn't there at that point, though. AusLondonder (talk) 08:41, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep, since found things that can go in it, one article that attended when it became Coleg Cambria, and sub-cats to the predecessors. Do understand that before these edits the category was empty for years. Dank Jae 10:00, 28 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: One article and a subcategory as of relisting; is that enough to keep the category?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:10, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Caves of Xinjiang

Propose renaming Category:Caves of Xinjiang to Category:Buddhist grottoes of Xinjiang

Nominator's rationale: These are all artificial, and thus not true caves. This is a more accurate description. Kingsmasher678 (talk) 19:38, 14 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Should actually be renamed to Category:Buddhist grottoes in Xinjiang Kingsmasher678 (talk) 19:41, 14 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Johnbod: you might want to comment on this one as well. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:14, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Rename Category:Buddhist caves in Xinjiang. "Grotto" is merely the Italian for "cave", & in English is an old-fashioned term we should not be using. Most of the individual articles/parents use the standard term "cave", and so should we. As discussed in the Indian cases, that "These are all artificial" is a somewhat dubious statement. Johnbod (talk) 18:06, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Rename target? There are three possibilities floating around.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 21:12, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Add "Buddhist" anyway, per content of the articles. The article grotto says a grotto can be a natural or an artificial cave, so even if these in Xinjiang are artificial caves then the word "cave" still isn't wrong. So I will support Category:Buddhist caves in Xinjiang too. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:36, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Category:Chinese Buddhist grottoes is the parent, but that in turn is a child of Category:Buddhist caves and Category:Grottoes. I suggest a broader review to achieve consistency. jnestorius^(talk) 16:04, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, I have tagged this parent category too. "In China" is the format that is used for other countries too. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:15, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Propose renaming Category:Chinese Buddhist grottoes to Category:Buddhist grottoes in China

I'd support consistency, but away from the corny "grotto", which the best RS don't use, though Chinese tourist material does. "Grotto" has become fixed as the word for small excavations or erections in Western Catholicism, and English landscape gardening etc (following the Italian, each for different reasons), but all the Buddhist ones in Category:Grottoes should go to "caves". Johnbod (talk) 03:59, 27 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Johnbod's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:10, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:627 BC establishments

Propose merging Category:627 BC establishments to Category:627 BC
Propose merging Category:626 BC establishments to Category:626 BC

Nominator's rationale: merge, isolated single-article categories, this is not helpful for navigation. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:39, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose putting Neo-Babylonian Empire into Category:626 BC seems less helpful for navigation either from Category to article or vice versa. The connection between them is opaque. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jnestorius (talk • contribs) 16:09, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That is how it is done with other year establishments in these ancient times too. Hence these two categories are isolated. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:22, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

More useful and logical to upmerge to Category:620s BC establishments. jnestorius^(talk) 11:50, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Establishments categories by decade start after 400 BC and the two articles in the nominated category are already in an establishment category by century. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Marcocapelle's most recent comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:07, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Fictional Belgian people

Propose renaming Category:Fictional Belgian people to Category:Fictional people created by Belgians

Nominator's rationale: The current name gives the impression that these are characters with an in-universe nationality or citizenship. Most of them have no defined nationality though and are (often deliberately) created as somewhat "universal" or vaguely Western European. A rename of the category may make this clearer (better suggestions for the new name are welcome!) Fram (talk) 13:22, 14 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Procedural oppose, this should be discussed together with the sibling categories. Just renaming Belgium does not make sense. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:42, 14 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Without comment on what the categories should be for, the current category tree does contain some articles (e.g. Doctor Evil, Hercule Poirot) where the character is specifically Belgian but the creator is not, some where both character and creator are Belgian (e.g. Tintin (character)), and some where the creator is Belgian but the character is not specifically, or if they are no mention is made of it in the relevant article (e.g. Gil Jourdan lives in Paris; if he is canonically Belgian our article does not mention it). There are also several articles included which are about the work of fiction rather than the character (La Patrouille des Castors, L'Élève Ducobu). Whatever happens to the category it could do with cleaning up. Caeciliusinhorto-public (talk) 12:45, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Tintin is never officially or canonically stated to be Belgian, although much points to it. But perhaps the category needs splitting instead of deleting then, any suggestions what the best name might be for the ones created by a Belgian? Fram (talk) 11:32, 16 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, The Bushranger _{One ping only} 06:07, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

oppose The nationality or ethnicity of the creator is not defining for the characters. Category:Fictional people created by Belgians would have to be deleted. Dimadick (talk) 10:29, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Dimadick's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 20:06, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Swarthmore Garnet

Propose merging Category:Swarthmore Garnet to Category:Swarthmore Garnet Tide

Nominator's rationale: All the college's sports teams should be under one category. It seems like the football team is referred to as the Garnet Tide while all other teams are referred to as just Garnet -- this also means that Category:Swarthmore Garnet Tide should be renamed to Category:Swarthmore Garnet after the merger, and the following should all be renamed/merged:

--Habst (talk) 15:05, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: I will tag the additional categories. If there are no further comments in a week, we should be all set for renaming/merging.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 19:57, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Biodiversity Heritage Library Enthusiasts

Propose deleting Category:Biodiversity Heritage Library Enthusiasts (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: WP:OC/U#irrelevant likes. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 18:08, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Video game protagonists

Propose deleting Category:Video game protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Video game antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Ubisoft antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Square Enix antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Sony Interactive Entertainment antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:SNK antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Sega antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Nintendo antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Namco antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Microsoft antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Konami antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Capcom antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Blizzard Entertainment antagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose merge Category:Street Fighter protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) to Category:Street Fighter characters (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose merge Category:Resident Evil protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) to Category:Resident Evil characters (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Koei Tecmo protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Konami protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Microsoft protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Namco protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:NetherRealm Studios protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Nintendo protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Sega protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:SNK protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Sony Interactive Entertainment protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Square Enix protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Final Fantasy protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:Ubisoft protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose merge Category:Fire Emblem protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) to Category:Fire Emblem characters (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose merge Category:The Legend of Zelda protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) to Category:The Legend of Zelda characters (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose merge Category:Mario (franchise) protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) to Category:Mario (franchise) characters (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose merge Category:Pokémon protagonists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) to Category:Pokémon characters (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: These categories and all the children therein are really poorly defined: a lot of times characters in a series are often protagonists and antagonists depending on perspective, as we can see from just how often they overlap. A lot of it relies on WP:OR, and no other fictional media category has similar: even its counterpart in film was deleted years upon years ago. Kung Fu Man (talk) 15:29, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Ministers for creative industries (Victoria)

Propose merging Category:Ministers for creative industries (Victoria) to Category:Ministers for the arts (Victoria)

Nominator's rationale: Essentially the same ministerial portfolio, just different names. No need to differentiate. GMH Melbourne (talk) 12:50, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Canadian Intellectual Property Office

Propose deleting Category:Canadian Intellectual Property Office (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: There is only one page in there and I do not see any possible addition to this category. Thus, I propose deletion. Veverve (talk) 12:41, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per WP:C2F, this could have been listed at speedy. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:02, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:People prosecuted under anti-homosexuality laws

Propose renaming Category:People prosecuted under anti-homosexuality laws to Category:People convicted under anti-homosexuality laws

Nominator's rationale: rename (and purge if needed), we categorize by people by conviction, not by prosecution. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:40, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:People charged with apostasy in Iran

Propose renaming Category:People charged with apostasy in Iran to Category:People convicted of apostosy in Iran

Nominator's rationale: rename, these people were convicted in Iranian courts. We normally have convicted people in the convicted category tree, I am not convinced that we should do otherwise in this case. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:30, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:NBA championship–winning players by nationality

Propose splitting Category:NBA championship–winning players from France to Category:NBA championship–winning players and Category:NBA players from France
Propose splitting Category:NBA championship–winning players from Australia to Category:NBA championship–winning players and Category:NBA players from Australia
Propose splitting Category:NBA championship–winning players from Canada to Category:NBA championship–winning players and Category:NBA players from Canada

Nominator's rationale: Dual merge per WP:NARROWCAT. I don't think its necessary to divide championship winners by nationality when they are already in the nationality category for players. Omnis Scientia (talk) 10:10, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Indian Paintbrush (company) films

Propose renaming Category:Indian Paintbrush (company) films to Category:Indian Paintbrush films

Nominator's rationale: Unnecessary disambiguation. No other category with "indian paintbrush" currently exists and even if they did, "films" exists as a natural disambiguator. ~ Dissident93 ^(talk) 15:57, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This is the wrong order. First article Indian Paintbrush (company) should be renamed, thereafter this category can follow. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:30, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Marcocapelle's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 06:26, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:People associated with Lewis Roca Rothgerber Christie

Propose deleting Category:People associated with Lewis Roca Rothgerber Christie (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: Vague and unnecessary. WP:ASSOCIATEDWITH concerns. For most entires, won't be WP:CATDEF meamemg (talk) 23:37, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete, textbook case of WP:OCASSOC. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:23, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment This is how the lawyer/company intersection categories have historically been formed, see Category:People by law firm in the United States. If there is a problem with the nominated category, other categories in this parent category should be examined as well. Clay (talk) 16:40, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Seems to be an association by company. Dimadick (talk) 15:31, 27 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Clay's and Dimadick's comments?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 06:25, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If kept, rename to Category:Lewis Roca Rothgerber Christie people which is the default for people by company, per Dimadick. But still it is mostly a case of WP:PERFCAT and WP:NONDEF. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:33, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Films with songs by the Sherman Brothers

Propose deleting Category:Films with songs by the Sherman Brothers (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: It makes sense to categorize Category:Songs written by the Sherman Brothers, but is it necessary to categorize the films in which they wrote songs for in this manner. Should this expand to include Category:Films with songs by Kenny Loggins and the like? Film articles tend to already get overcategorized as it is by genre, location, awards, producer, director, etc.. If kept, I'd recommend changing to "Films with songs written by the Sherman Brothers". Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 22:36, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:24, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I don't think overcategorization is an issue. It is often hard to locate film articles without categories grouping them by creative personnel. Dimadick (talk) 10:18, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Dimadick's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 06:25, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

E.g. Winnie the Pooh and the Blustery Day is in no less than 27 categories, so overcategorization is definitely an issue in the films tree. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:38, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete This feels like WP:OCASSOCATION. Certainly no objection to a list article though. - RevelationDirect (talk) 14:32, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Professional wrestling shows in British Columbia

Propose renaming Category:Professional wrestling shows in British Columbia to Category:Professional wrestling shows in Vancouver

Nominator's rationale: A request to speedily rename this category to match the contents of the category was opposed. There are no articles on this topic except for those which took place in Vancouver so this is an unnecessary layer of categorization. User:Namiba 15:17, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Given this was opposed at speedy, giving extra time for objections.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 06:17, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:English High School of Boston alumni

Propose renaming Category:English High School of Boston alumni to Category:The English High School alumni

Nominator's rationale: The corresponding article for this category is titled The English High School. That article also says that it is "[c]ommonly referred to as Boston English." "English High School of Boston" should not be an option for the name of this category. Dennis C. Abrams (talk) 03:27, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It may be a better idea ~~to rename the article to Boston English and have the category renamed to Category:Boston English alumni.~~ Marcocapelle (talk) 03:42, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe not such a great idea after all. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:08, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose renaming to Category:The English High School alumni. Whatever the title of the article, it is likely that some users would be confused by that, thinking that it refers to high schools in England, or to some other school known as "The English High School", such as the one in Lynn, Massachusetts, or the one in Providence, Rhode Island, or the one in Nişantaşı, Turkey (now renamed). A far better idea is to rename the article on the school to make its identity clear, to something such as "The English High School, Boston". I don't like the idea of renaming it to "Boston English"; certainly that would not be desirable unless it can be shown that that is by a significant margin the commonest name used for the school, and even then I wouldn't support it, because to most people that would mean the variety of the English language spoken in Boston. JBW (talk) 13:30, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on JBW's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 05:53, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Buddhist cave temples

Propose renaming Category:Buddhist cave temples in Andhra Pradesh to Category:Buddhist caves in Andhra Pradesh
Propose renaming Category:Buddhist cave temples in Gujarat to Category:Buddhist caves in Gujarat
Propose renaming Category:Buddhist cave temples in Madhya Pradesh to Category:Buddhist caves in Madhya Pradesh
Propose renaming Category:Buddhist cave temples in Maharashtra to Category:Buddhist caves in Maharashtra

Nominator's rationale: rename follow-up on this previous discussion and aligning with parent category name. @Kingsmasher678 and Johnbod: pinging contributors to previous discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:25, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support rename, but oppose this target. Something to clarify that these are manmade would be nice, because these features are almost exclusively rock-cut architecture not caves. In fact, I think I only saw one natural cave in the whole bunch when I was sorting them by state. That was the original idea I had when I named to cats, though it missed the mark!

Kingsmasher678 (talk) 17:31, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support Best solution so far. You can't always tell whether a large excavation began as a natural cave or not. Johnbod (talk) 23:14, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am trying to go through the cave categories right now and these are practically the only group of human structures called caves in the entire tree. It's also kind of irrelevant if it started natural, because it sure isn't now, and would therefore be rock-cut.

Kingsmasher678 (talk) 01:29, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I can see you find it annoying that the standard term is caves, but it just is. The forms found in India typically fall into two main types, often both represented at large sites like the Ajanta Caves, viharas, the most numerous, which can't be called temples, and chaityas, which generally can. So "caves" is used as a group term. Johnbod (talk) 02:30, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I’m not arguing for the current names, I’m arguing that they should be clarified to be rock cut or at least indicated that they aren’t natural, because in the caves tree, nearly everything is natural. It’s an important distinction. I mean, we literally have an article about the correct term. I’m not trying to call them temples, as I have been told that isn’t right. Sorry if there was some confusion.

Kingsmasher678 (talk) 20:35, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Also, both of those article you linked called the structures temple, just so you know.

Kingsmasher678 (talk) 20:36, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Rename target?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 03:46, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Foreign residents of Mexican California

Propose merging Category:Foreign residents of Mexican California to Category:People of Alta California
Propose merging Category:Naturalized citizens of Mexican California to Category:People of Alta California

Nominator's rationale: merge, unnecessary distinction, especially at provincial level, and for the larger part we do not know if people were naturalized or not. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:29, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Quibbles with the proposed move: 1) Mexican California was not called Alta California from 1836 to 1847, but rather the Department of The Californias#Department_of_Mexico. 2) Therefore, "People of Alta California" would exclude people from the "Department" era. 3) I'm pretty sure that, for anyone notable enough to be in Wikipedia, we know whether they were naturalized or not. And willingness to pursue naturalization (or not) tells us a lot about those individuals. WCCasey (talk) 16:00, 16 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on WCCasey's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 16:43, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 03:45, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Marcocapelle: Thoughts? House Blaster (talk • he/they) 03:45, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Scientists from Plano, Texas

Propose merging Category:Scientists from Plano, Texas to Category:People from Plano, Texas

Nominator's rationale: Category with two entries. Also upmerge entries to Scientists from Texas, Lost in Quebec (talk) 19:27, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Probably single merge to Category:People from Plano, Texas, these people were just born in Texas, not scientists in Texas. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:29, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Added more people to the category. Dick Haugland was a scientist in Plano. Flurrious (talk) 23:08, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Marcocapelle's and Flurrious's comments?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 03:44, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Gravity Rush (franchise)

Propose deleting Category:Gravity Rush (franchise) (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: There are only 3 real pages that belong here, GR1, GR2 and Kat. I don't think this passes the bar for a franchise category, much as I wish it did. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 00:23, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(category creator) For what it's worth, it also contains a navigation template and four files. I think PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale also fits in the category pretty solidly considering all its other franchise categories, and the two real-world people are relevant enough to categorize too, in my opinion. I'll say keep, but I'm fine if it's deleted (admittedly, all I know about Gravity Rush is from Scott the Woz). — gabldotink [ talk | contribs | global account ] 01:20, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Well, All-Stars Battle Royale shouldn't be in any franchise categories. Per WP:CATDEF, it has to be defining for the game (i.e. being a literal part of that franchise, not having a cameo character from it). ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 05:18, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Three articles *is* enough for a franchise category, in my opinion (and past experience), also note that there are also the files. It may need some trimming, but there is enough here. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 04:58, 14 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Seeing consensus to at least purge, but no consensus on whether this should continue to exist.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 16:54, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Purge or delete?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 02:48, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Professional wrestling debut categories

Propose deleting Category:1987 professional wrestling debuts (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Propose deleting Category:1988 professional wrestling debuts (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: I don't see a scheme for debuts for pro wrestlers or really any other profession, just things like Category:Debut albums and Category:Directorial debut films. The year of a wrestler's debut is not a defining characteristic to the individual. These are available as lists in 1987 in professional wrestling#Debuts and 1988 in professional wrestling#Debuts, respectively. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 22:59, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - The year wrestlers debut is noteworthy. Pretty much all Japanese wrestlers have rivals based off of the year they debuted like Chono/Mutoh/Hashimoto. Sometimes teams are formed based on years people debuted. There's often rookie cups and titles. I would look at it more like Category:1990 films. Unlike other sports or even movies, there's no organized amateur pro wrestling scene. You are a pro wrestler when you have your first match. KatoKungLee (talk) 01:53, 13 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Shouldn't the category then be more along the lines of "Professional wrestlers who debuted in 1987"? Anyway, the equivalent in other sports would be a player's rookie season, and no one is categorizing Michael Jordan by playing his first professional basketball game in 1984. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 02:39, 13 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rookies in other sports have already played organized ball for many years at various levels by the time they make the major leagues. Michael Jordan's first pro game was in 1984. When a wrestler debuts, they are a wrestler from that day forward. It doesn't matter whether it's in WWE or something like Ice Ribbon, it's counted the same because there are no organized amateur leagues. How long you've been around and when you've debuted tells you a lot about variou wrestlers.KatoKungLee (talk) 19:08, 13 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete as non-defining and trivial.--User:Namiba 19:12, 13 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 16:55, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 02:47, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:People executed by the United States federal government by lethal injection

Propose deleting Category:People executed by the United States federal government by lethal injection (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: Unnecessary category that duplicates Category:21st-century executions by the United States federal government. All 16 entries are in that category and vice versa. Lost in Quebec (talk) 22:59, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Don't know. The articles of this category should still be part of the tree of Category:People executed by the United States by lethal injection, right? Marcocapelle (talk) 05:58, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Marcocapelle's comment?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 02:41, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Juvenile prisons in England

Propose deleting Category:Juvenile prisons in England (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: Duplicates Category:Young Offender Institutions. AusLondonder (talk) 14:56, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Question: Shouldn't this be merged and redirected? ^SMason_Garrison 22:19, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Mason's question. Or alternatively should Category:Young Offender Institutions in England become a subcategory of Category:Juvenile prisons in England? Marcocapelle (talk) 04:36, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on Marcocapelle and Smasongarrison's comments?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 17:58, 20 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: See above relisting comment
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, House Blaster (talk • he/they) 02:38, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@AusLondonder: for better or for worse, there are 6 articles in Category:Juvenile prisons in England that aren't in Category:Young Offender Institutions in England. Something needs to be done with these 6 if the category is deleted. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:02, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]